Jeff: Another thought: buy a hygrometer and monitor the climate where the guitar is kept. Be sure that the temperature and humidity remain constant and are neutral (i.e., something between 65-72 degrees and 40-50% humidity). Others here may have their opinions as to the definition of “neutral,” but that’s mine.

And, as always, keep the guitar in its case when you’re not playing it. Lastly, please read the http://www.collingsguitars.com “care and feeding” page. They go into some depth as to how to protect your guitar for heat, cold, and humidity, as well as other helpful tips.

You may find that the guitar will bounce-back if treated in this manner.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: tonosity,

Can I start off by saying that I am pleased that both the seller and buyer are talking to each other to try and resolve the problem.
I had a Collings D2AV Varnish shipped from Texas to the UK in April it was shipped via UPS on a Monday and arrived the following Wednesday. I have no idea what the weather was like in Texas in late April I do know it was reasonably warm (15C) but damp in England when the guitar arrived in perfect condition. The guitar strings had been loosed off and it had been packed very well there were no marks on the outer packaging to suggest any signs of mishandling on the part of UPS.
What concerns me is not heat but the excessive cold in the hold of the aeroplane would this effect the guitar in an adverse way as heat would?
Also I am not sure about keeping the guitar in the case. I keep mine on a stand in my hi-fi, come cinema, come music room as I feel the guitar picks up the vibrations from the speakers and helps to loosen it up. Any thoughts?

Hello Bob, any extreme temperature is going to be harmful to any instrument. You need to treat it like a person when it comes to temperature changes. As far as keeping it out of the case, that's fine as long as the temperature and humidity are within range, otherwise I'd keep it in the case whenever I'm not playing it. The vibrations from stereo equipment aren't going to affect the top much unless you're really blasting the music and the guitar is in front of it all the time, your best bet is just playing it as often as you can.
Cheers.

Yes, the “in the case when not playing it” is pretty common advice, and appears on Collings “care and feeding” page.

I’m also intrigued by the cold aspect of the shipping, and the fact that it was most certainly a by-air shipment—at least partially. Additionally, I’m confused by the nature of the damage that was reported by Jeff (again, by only one non-Collings repair person), which was unclear if it is a result of too much, or too little, moisture. But, as I understand it, cold = dry, and hot = wet. Still hard to understand how a 4-hour flight, even in a unheated portion of the plane’s belly could be so cold as to dry-out the guitar and cause distortion to the structure of the instrument.

Finish checking is another story. That I could imagine, given drastic swings to cold temperatures—as sonoman had the displeasure of experiencing first hand.

Funny story: I was at NAMM in January, and PRS had on display their new line of acoustics—believe it or not. One of them had a spider-web pattern of finish checking. And with the display lighting really making it stand-out, as well. I couldn’t believe they’d have it on display, with such an obvious sign of damage.

The funny part is that Mr. Paul Reed Smith was there telling anyone who’d ask, that this wasn’t a case of damage at all. He said that they are experimenting with new esthetics in guitar finishes, and this was a sample of their work.

That guy is too much!

the range of opinions on guitar care are as wide as the range of the jackalope. Blazer and Henkes advise keeping the guitar OUT of its case as much as possible. I'm presuming their advice was not a German joke. I leave my cases open quite frequently to encourage that UV patina; of course, we live in as benign a climate as there is, just about, and the house temp is in the seventies and the ambient humidity is in the forties. They're not as finicky and delicate as it's being made out, having to have some Dr. Strangelove controlled room with gauges and blinking lights and temperature and humidity control devices (and theft alarms, naturally). They're built to last and they're built to play. don't leave 'em in the trunk. don't play 'em in the snow, or in the desert in the summer. A modicum of care and common sense and you're good to go. I've owned guitars for 43 years and never had any major repair on the 50 or 60 guitars that have flowed through our various domiciles. Chill out (but not too cold). tom

Yes, that's all true. But I think the point of the thread is to come-up with some kind of reasonable explanation as to how a guitar *could* be damaged by climate issues in transit by a shipping company--other than impact damage. (Jeff didn’t report anything like that.)

I too have much experience in sending and receiving guitars--probably 20, in both directions. And I too have never had a problem. But Jeff is pursuing this as a possibility, and looking to file a claim with UPS, and I and the others are trying to help in coming-up with an explanation of how such a thing could happen, given the circumstances.

Jeff didn't report any finish checking, which would be explicable given what Bob Mc said about cargo holds on airplanes. The only cosmetic, or visual anomaly reported by Jeff was "a 1/32 of an inch" line along the front of the bridge, which he said was distorted. I don't know what that's about, and it doesn't make sense--to me--that it's a structural issue or a result of structural movement, given that the bridge of a guitar has the tendency to roll forward with the tension of the strings, making it lift from the back of the bridge, first. But then again, I’m not a Collings repair person.

Frankly, I believe if the guitar is normalized to a proper moisture content for a period of time--just to certain--and then adjusted to Jeff's playing preferences by a Collings repair facility, all will be well. In other words, it could simply be that I don’t have a problem with a slightly higher action on my guitars, and Jeff prefers very low action.

I also think a person needs to be careful how he presents a guitar to a music store for repair. They tend to get a little surly when it wasn’t purchased through them. Compounding that, they may take on a bit of an attitude if they are informed if was purchase on Ebay; which, as business people trying to make a living from selling new and used guitars, might be comparable to buying from Darth Vader, as far as they’re concerned. Therefore their remarks and advice may be rooted in something other than the actual state of the guitar.

Anyway, if there’s a rational case to be made to how the guitar may have been damaged in transit, Jeff would like our help in making it. For the claim money, if nothing else, to have the guitar put in a condition that he’s happy with. I, personally, don’t have any ethical problems with that, given that there is that *possibility.*

Hey guys got back from the Martin tech. The guitars ok, I love it..... moisture

I am a stupid old man

I am going to feed the dogs and plays some.

Any one want to sell me a guitar

Ha.

Sonoman, I would not advice you to leave your guitar out of the case too often here in Chicago.
These temperature changes can get pretty ridiculous, I've seen drops of up to 60 degees in a matter of a couple hours.
Not to mention how bitter the wind chill factor is in winter, and how humid it is in the summer.
Right now if the kids were to leave a bag of crackers or cheetos opened up, even for an hour, they would be get sogged out.

Papi: Sweet Home Chicago is just a great song to me, and I'm not a city guy. Not any more. But we did live where the temps ranged from the mid-nineties above zero to sixty below zero, and May or September could bring you three seasons in the space of an afternoon. I remember working on the garden, shirtless, a lovely early afternoon in the low eighties, and four hours later it was snowing and in the twenties. I didn't have the guitar outside. But I think Jeff just slipped a mea culpa past us, so lets' not spoil the moment. Peace. It's not just for breakfast any more. tom

All's well that ends well.

Yes, sonoman and Bill, and god bless everyone.

I like to get some closure of my own by summing-up my perspectives on this forum and some of the threads.

Since my involvement, due to controversy surrounding one of my Ebay auctions, and then by a private sale I made here in the forum, and then again by another Ebay auction, this forum leaves me with a feeling of empty frustration.

There are dynamics and behaviors here that should be identified and tagged. Primarily, because the moderator (or keeper) of this forum shouldn’t have to waste his time with such (expletive deleted) as this.

The motivation for my summation is to submit something of value, for the betterment of the forum, because I respect, admire and I'm consequently interested in Collings Guitars. I also respect the good works of the moderator, as well as his level-headed decisions, and his commendable goodwill. And let's not forget the creator of the forum, in the first place.

People seem to gravitation towards drama, and need to stop jumping to conclusions and projecting their own agendas long enough to remember what this forum is here to represent: Collings Guitars. It’s a resource of information about *them*, and should be contributed to as such. It’s not a battleground. Neither is it a podium for people to bather non-sequiturs and putting threads off-topic.

Creating the foundation for some of this misbehavior, admittedly, can be laid at my feet. I should never have told a story of wrongful doing by, some lowly still-to-reveal-himself person from this forum regarding one of my sales. So my guilt is certain, and I beat myself up about it regularly.

But I don’t have the feeling that others here have any sense of their own wrong-doing. Or do they-—by deed—-show respect for the reasons behind this forum’s creation.

Maybe, I’m just p-----off (sorry Elambo). I don’t know. But I should bear witness to this, and hopefully allow others to consider what they’re spending their time doing, and what might be more constructive.

I suggest that anything that has to do with the negotiations of transactions, that are posted on this forum be disallowed. Not just by the moderator, but by everyone who considers themselves regulars and value this forum. And given with what I’ve been through for the past couple of weeks, I think have the right to submit this radical idea. Regardless of whether you like or dislike moderators, moderate the forum in this manner yourselves. I think you’re all smart enough to take that on.

If you’d like to debate me on this, I’d be thrilled if you’d send a PM, mano e mano.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: tonosity,

Based on the evidence presented it is highly unlikely that any damage could've occured in a non-impact event. Contrary to popular belief holds of commercial aircraft do not drop below about 45F, and in some aft sections where live animals are transported it is more likely around 75F. Lots of delicate foods, wine, flowers etc are routinely transported in perfect condition on trans-continental flights.

Now if you choose to be a frugalist and take the Budget Option then it may go in the hold of a Liberian steamer, be abused on a torrid dock by disgruntled stevedores (are there any other kind?), and thence be transported by wagon train to your door. In this case you gets what you paid for.