Hi All,

Recently traded my D2H for an OM2H and haven't put it down since!

Looking to complement it with something with a little more low end oomph for more percussive fingerstyle and have seen Andy McKee and Don Ross use the Beneteau Concert Standard and make it really ring out clear on the fundamentals with good resonance behind it without getting muddy. They have also used Lowden Jumbos, sometimes the F series depending on the tune, but the Beneteau appears to cover a good deal of ground.


There's a Concert Standard and an MJ up for sale online and am quite curious, but don't want to plunge without some advised input as I can try Lowdens, Avalons and McIlroys (if you see one, try one!) here in Ireland.

Anybody any experience with them that they can share?

thnx

Hi Darach,

Marc makes a great guitar at a good price. He's also selling more at Dream Guitar these days, so have a look and see the past sales recordings also, and you can hear some additional recordings.

He lives not to far from me and I have been over to his place and have played a few of his guitars after he finished a batch, though it's been about two years. I also played a bubinga (or however you spell it) at Healdsberg a year ago of Marcs.

The Nick Lucas 13 fretter I played was pretty amazing.

Kenny on this forum has one of his guitars coming very very soon. I would much prefer a Beneteau to a lowden or Avalon, no question. But those are my tastes alone. Though I have researched and played both.

I am always loth to recommend a guitar unless you get to play it. I would give him a call. He's very friendly and talk to him about the guitar you are looking at and what you are after.

He'll give you some good advice.

His guitars sell well right across North America.

Stuart

Hi Stuart,

thanks for the input, have listened to the samples at dreamguitars, they have a really good combo of attack and definition but with a good sense of body and depth without getting mushy or overly choral like a lowden when you dig in.

that concert model with the bevel and port is an incredible piece of work and is now on my own personal dreamguitars list!
(and maybe an om deep body..)

the workshop is a bit of a trip from Dublin but would definitely like to try before I buy as despite the fact that they are great instruments, at that price range, you've got to make sure you relate to that particular hunk of wood.
not sure I could stretch the budget to a brand new model at the moment so will keep an eye on the ads and evilbay and dreamguitars.

thanks again.

Darach

Darach,

You need to take a holiday in North America and stop one or two places where they have a Beneteau guitar.

I too am nervous about buying unless I have played the guitar. But of course travel with flight, well, you have to have it in mind to do that traveling with family and or friends so that the cost is about the experience of travel and not just about the guitar.

Last year I saw the west coast and happened to travel to Healdsberg for instance. In fact I bumped into Marc there and spoke with him and played a guitar of his.

You should make such a journey.

I have also heard very good things about McIlroys, but I also get him confused with another builder whose name is very similar and I can never remember which I prefer because of that. As I recal he used to work making Lowden guitars, but I could be forgetting my facts.



Stuart

Hi Stuart,

made it to the Martin factory last time, but next time, I'll try and make a pilgrimage to a Beneteau dealer, or better still, hit Canadian territory, still never made it that far!

You're right, Dermot McIlroy is the Irish luthier who used to work for Lowden, went out on his own and has a small workshop, dropped in for a cup of tea and a strum last time I was up, great guy and beautiful guitars, very chimey choral sound, almost more so that the lowdens in some ways.

McElroy is the other guy you're thinking of, think he's NA based.

Lowden, Avalon and McIlroy guitars although all featuring similar genetics are quite different animals in their own rights.

all the best

Darach

Thanks Darach,

Oh I do know Lowdens and Avalons. Ever listen to Andy Sheppard's first album. He played a Lowden Mahogany Cedartop. I think that was an O10. I loved the sound and went in search of that guitar. Made a few trips into the US just to play one or two. Even bought a S35 maple cedar that was in mint. Bought it for $1600, sold it for $2300. But the sound I was after was not to be found, and I did find all of the Lowden's I tried to fall short. You know the story. They have been produced in four different locations, with different wood sources and different builders, including Avalon, so I guess there is no real surprise.


Too much melange of tone for me and the quality of the guitar was not quite there. I like the newer Lowdens better than the Avalon's I haev tried though. But I have not tried the more expensive Avalons.

And my gut tells me that Mc..would come out first of those choices.

But take your time. Go to a festival. If your thinking of hand built, then go for it. But be patient grasshopper. And make sure you play before you pay.

best,

Stuart

Stuart is right about Andy Sheppard... the guy is a great fingerstyle player from the school of Pierre Bensusan and Don Ross. I met him at the Canadian Guitar Fest last year and immediately bought his CD after hearing him for the first time.

Beneteaus are the most underated guitars out there today. We hear people rave about those high priced guitars, but Beneteau has been building since some of those guys were in diapers. I bought my first Bene in 2003, a concert standard in adi/hond rosewood. In five years it has never had a setup and still plays like the day it came to me. I have a sitka/maple Concert Standard on order and a baritone sitka/walnut that is outstanding. IMO, you cannot go wrong with a Beneteau as with a Collings.

Thanks Kenny..

Don Ross is actually playing in Ireland next week..with Andy McKee!! but on a Tuesday night 3.5 hours drive away...what a pain.

if it came down to a choice between an MJ and a Concert Standard as a good all-rounder (excluding Pete Townsend windmills!) seems like you favour the concert, do you find it covers a lot of bases?

D,

First off, it is worth driving to see either Don or Andy. In 2006 I drove over 500 miles out to his house in Canada for a workshop weekend with Alex DeGrassi. Far and away the best guitar weekend I've been to. Andy McKee is something special, very musical and talented. Don is also very special, an innovator.

I almost bought an MJ over the CS. I think either would cover all you bases, the MJ would probably be deeper, more note separation, but more difficult to hold and play. For fingerstyle, you cannot go wrong with the Concert Standard body size. If you do a lot of strumming too, then the MJ would be the ticket providing you have long enough arms to not have any physical problems reaching over the body for extended periods of time. I have a 6 foot frame so the MJ would work for me, but I also have two Collings SJ's so I have that need covered. It is difficult to find one guitar to do it all. My advice is to first buy the guitar that best covers the style you play, then add guitars as you find the budget. No man can have just one guitar to do it all ;-)

Thanks for the insight Kenny,

one guitar to rule them all does seem to be somewhat of a fallacy...and a fantastic justification to continually give in to GAS

couldn't face the drive, 150 miles in Ireland is 3.5 hours over mostly crappy, traffic laden roads...so thankfully I'd seen Andy already this year which took the sting out of it...sure it was a great gig though, would love to get to see the two of them together, got "the thing that came from somewhere" that they released, great musicianship and excellent roadmusic!

got to try another new Lowden factory F series last weekend and they are really special sounding guitars, they overcome the "melange of tone" that Stuart describes which is very apt as some of them can tend to go into harmonic overdrive and lose the plot. it may be in the mind, but they seem to have a more focussed sound while still retaining that "juice" without going completely ott on the built in chorus effect.

prices are coming up to Beneteau levels, floating around $4k for the base models. The F25 rw/cedar was really nice, but I'd love to try the F32 with spruce top.

there's a clip on vintageguitar.co.uk of a beautiful F25C they have on special, gives you a flavour, less loose, more beneteauish, but still got that celtic flavour going on.

Guitar
http://www.vintageguitar.co.uk/item--Lowden-F25C--LowdenF25C16154.html
Clip
http://vintageguitar.co.uk/sb1/playa/mp3/LowdenF25C.mp3

the search continues..

Hi Stuart/Kenny,

borrowed my friend's A25 Walnut/Cedar McIlroy this weekend and was impressed by its clarity, projection (loud!!) and playability...tying into the fact that they just built their 500th guitar, I put this piece together to showcase the guitar...

seems to me it hits a pretty good middle ground between a Concert Beneteau and an F series Lowden..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YuI5BnTcOQE

Darach

Darach

The Lowdens I've seen priced recently have been around $5300 - $5400 new. In the US. I'm in Canada, but do most of my guitar chasing in the US.

I was unable to listen to your clip. For some reason since I just got back from hoiliday I can't seem to get Utube to work. Adobe flash upgrade doesn't seem to want to take.

I listened to the recording at the guitar store link. Trebles are pretty round. Almost like my 000 Collings. Would have thought they would have had a little more bite. Not a bad thing. I do after all love my 000. It is a 14 fret is it not. Yes, had more clarity than I have heard on other Lowdens. Almost sounded like it is a baratone.

Will try to listen to your recording as soon as can get it working.


Stuart

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Stuart,